並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-91-%E7%A9%BA%E9%A0%AD%E8%BD%89%E5%A4%9A%E9%A0%AD-%E5%A6%82%E4%BD%95%E6%8E%8C%E6%8F%A1-%E8%B2%A1%E5%AF%8C%E7%BF%BB%E5%80%8D-%E6%99%82%E6%A9%9F/id1531443831?i=1000565428441