並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/%E5%93%87%E8%B3%BD%E5%BF%83%E8%A7%80%E9%BB%9E-ep18-%E8%81%B7%E5%A0%B4%E4%B8%8A%E9%9D%A2%E8%A9%A6%E5%AE%98%E6%98%AF%E6%80%8E%E9%BA%BC%E6%83%B3%E7%9A%84feat-%E6%89%80%E5%A4%A7%E7%88%BA/id1500162537?i=1000496408234